Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

Noggin182
> * a parameter in the build toolchain to allow to specify where the SDK will be after a compile source build. This would allow to to compile source and then move source somewhere else. I know source is not for production but for validation purpose or to solve a tricky bug, we need debug message in prod environment for example, so this may be improved either by allowing (not by default) debug message in compile build (how to still get the correct file and line number in errors ?) or by simplifying compile source SDK path problem.

I'm quite sure Thomas added support so you could modify macros from the
command line, you should be able to use this for what you want.

Matt


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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

Noggin182
In reply to this post by Andreas Ecker
Hi,
(Sorry it's been so long, been away doing server side coding).

I agree with what most peopl have said, but wanted to comment on
something possibly unique. When I find a bug or quirk in the framework,
or I want to know how something works internally so I can tweak it, I
just look at the source code. There has been many times when I've been
going through other frameworks and have been shocked at some of the
source code. Several TODO comments, comments saying that this line of
code won't work under a certain condition, really bad programming
habbits, seriously obvios bugs etc... And quite often in comercial
frameworks!!

Whilst browsing the qooxdoo source code, I have to be honest and say
that there has been a few times I haven't seen what I like, but then
that is expected, I'm a picky perfectionist (Well try to be)! But a lot
of the time I am impressed. I have actually said "awesome" out load a
few times when I've realised something ;) Out of all of the frameworks I
have source code for qooxdoo is deffinately the best to follow, it seems
well written, thought out, complete, maintained well and it is easy to
read. This has helped us greatly! There are a few things that we've
tweaked in qooxdoo, knowing what we want it's been so easy to go through
the source code, follow a locially chain, find the right class and then
create a patch to do the job.


Keep it up!
Matt

P.S. The same actually applies for the toolchain. I've found a few
generator bugs in the past but have usually been able to look at the
scripts and fix it within minutes, and I've never even written a python
script! Signs of a deffinately well thought out framework!

Andreas Ecker wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> while approaching the qooxdoo 1.0 release due next week, we'd like to
> gather some feedback from you about the strong points of qooxdoo.
>
> This is valuable input (targeting about/feature pages, announcements)
> for other users, particularly new users, to get to know about the most
> important aspects of qooxdoo.
>
> It is important that you don't really think about what _could_ be
> relevant for others, but what were and are the most relevant aspects
> _for you_ and your project specifically. Your individual "user's view"
> if you will. This certainly includes technical aspects, of course, but
> also non-technical ones like project and/or community.
>
> Looking forward to your favorite "pros",
>
> Andreas
>


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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

fritz
Hi Matt

On Wed, 9 Dec 2009, Matthew Gregory wrote:

> Whilst browsing the qooxdoo source code, I have to be honest and say
> that there has been a few times I haven't seen what I like, but then
> that is expected, I'm a picky perfectionist (Well try to be)!

I can't speak for the Qooxdoo developers, but I myself would be most
grateful if you pointed out "imperfect" things in my code to ... even better
with suggestions for improvement ... ;-)

Cheers,
Fritz

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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

Noggin182
Fritz Zaucker wrote:
> I can't speak for the Qooxdoo developers, but I myself would be most
> grateful if you pointed out "imperfect" things in my code to ... even better
> with suggestions for improvement ... ;-)

It's not often that it happens. If it is a problem then I report a bug
(usually with a patch as I'm looking at that class anyway). A lot of the
times its just personal preferences


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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

benco
In reply to this post by fritz
Hello,

In my opinion, the new data binding features are what I prefer the most. It helps cleaning codes with thousand of addListener() methods with smart and simple declarations.

I haven't took a look at the new virtual widgets implementations yet but it looks also great. I think I may use it when the table widget will have a complete equivalent via qx.ui.virtual (supposing it's not yet the case)...

Form manager and controller are also a very useful feature (managing big forms was horrible in qx 0.7).

Finally, I like very much the way some widgets are customisable thanks to the abstract classes (trees, lists, tabs ...).

I'm not so fan of the new visual theme introduced in qx 0.8 - "too much grey" but it's more a personal opinion... Maybe what lacks now is good documentation and examples about themes handling (as well as a theme repository where great graphists could submit their creations... - maybe I'm dreaming a bit at this stage :)) ?

Thanks to the qx team for your great job !

Best,

Benoît.
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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

Thomas Herchenroeder
In reply to this post by Noggin182


Matthew Gregory wrote:
* a parameter in the build toolchain to allow to specify where the SDK will be after a compile source build. This would allow to to compile source and then move source somewhere else. I know source is not for production but for validation purpose or to solve a tricky bug, we need debug message in prod environment for example, so this may be improved either by allowing (not by default) debug message in compile build (how to still get the correct file and line number in errors ?) or by simplifying compile source SDK path problem.
    

I'm quite sure Thomas added support so you could modify macros from the 
command line, you should be able to use this for what you want.
  

The way the source version is currently built burns relative paths to all relevant libraries into the generated script. You can tweak the "compile-source/root" config setting, to specify the target directory for the index.html from which the app will eventually be loaded (and, yes, you could do this via a macro, the value of which you supply with a command-line option). Then all relative paths will be relative to *that* target directory. But that requires that all libraries stay where they are, *including* the app you are building. Just the index.html is in the remote location.

Alternatively, the "library" config key allows you to specify a "uri" sub-key. You would have to list all of the involved libraries including the current app, and add "uri" keys to each entry. The "uri" key could be a relative path from the remote index.html, or an absolute URI starting with "http://...".

I would be interested to learn if either of this works for JBB.

T.


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Logging in qooxdoo

balage42-qooxdoo
Hi everyone!

I have a quite silly question: I tried to figure out, how the logging system works.
I found the methods debug, info, warning and error of the Object, and the console.log function.
The later seems to work only with Firefox and Firebug, but having a console.log call in the source makes the application to throw exception when opening from other browsers.
OTOH, I wasn't able to find whrere it goes and how I could get the results produced by Object methods.

I tried to find info, but starting to realize, that many of the documentation (called "Manual") of Qooxdoo is rather a very high level summary of the features than a manual.

Thank you!

Balage


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Re: Logging in qooxdoo

fritz
Hi Balage,

I think the "magic" is in the following lines of code that are generated by
the template creation tool create-application.py

       // Enable logging in debug variant
       if (qx.core.Variant.isSet("qx.debug", "on"))
       {
         // support native logging capabilities, e.g.
         // Firebug for Firefox
         qx.log.appender.Native;
         // support additional
         // cross-browser console. Press F7
         // to toggle visibility
         qx.log.appender.Console;
      }

The if statement enables debugging only for the source-version (or disables
it for the build-version) and the last line makes sure that there is a place
to go for the messages if your are not running a browser with built-in
console support.

Cheers,
Fritz

On Wed, 9 Dec 2009, [hidden email] wrote:

> Hi everyone!
>
> I have a quite silly question: I tried to figure out, how the logging system works.
> I found the methods debug, info, warning and error of the Object, and the console.log function.
> The later seems to work only with Firefox and Firebug, but having a console.log call in the source makes the application to throw exception when opening from other browsers.
> OTOH, I wasn't able to find whrere it goes and how I could get the results produced by Object methods.
>
> I tried to find info, but starting to realize, that many of the documentation (called "Manual") of Qooxdoo is rather a very high level summary of the features than a manual.
>
> Thank you!
>
> Balage

--
Oetiker+Partner AG tel: +41 62 775 9903 (direct)
Fritz Zaucker                        +41 62 775 9900 (switch board)
Aarweg 15                            +41 79 675 0630 (mobile)
CH-4600 Olten                   fax: +41 62 775 9905
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Re: Logging in qooxdoo

Daniel Wagner
Administrator
In reply to this post by balage42-qooxdoo
Hi Balage,

logging in qooxdoo is split up into a central logging engine (the static
class qx.log.Logger) which receives and dispatches log messages, and one
or more log appenders which do the actual processing, such as storing
and/or displaying messages.

The debug/info/warn/error methods that each qooxdoo object inherits from
qx.core.Object call the corresponding methods of qx.log.Logger, which in
turn calls the process() method of all appenders that are registered
with it.

A typical qooxdoo application will register two appenders:
qx.log.appender.Native uses the browser's own logging capabilities
(Firebug etc.) while qx.log.appender.Console is useful for browsers
without such tools. It is opened by pressing F7. If those or the other
appenders found in the qx.log.appender namespace aren't enough for your
needs, you can always write your own appender. I suggest looking at the
source of qx.log.appender.Element for inspiration.

There's no need to use console.log directly in your application: The
native logger uses it if the browser supports it, preventing any
exceptions if it isn't.


Regards,
Daniel

[hidden email] schrieb:

> Hi everyone!
>
> I have a quite silly question: I tried to figure out, how the logging
> system works.
> I found the methods debug, info, warning and error of the Object, and
> the console.log function.
> The later seems to work only with Firefox and Firebug, but having a
> console.log call in the source makes the application to throw exception
> when opening from other browsers.
> OTOH, I wasn't able to find whrere it goes and how I could get the
> results produced by Object methods.
>
> I tried to find info, but starting to realize, that many of the
> documentation (called "Manual") of Qooxdoo is rather a very high level
> summary of the features than a manual.
>
> Thank you!
>
> Balage
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Return on Information:
> Google Enterprise Search pays you back
> Get the facts.
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/google-dev2dev
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> qooxdoo-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/qooxdoo-devel


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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

fritz
In reply to this post by panyasan
On Wed, 9 Dec 2009, panyasan wrote:

> - a more polished website - important for PR purposes (we're competing with
>   http://www.dojotoolkit.org/, for example)

I don't really see the dojo Website as being much "better" than the
Qooxdoo-site. They look different, but that's seems to me to be a matter of
taste, mostly.

The most important feature of a useful website (in my opinion) is ease of
navigation and that in my experience mainly means that

- I have an always visible navigation area (because I usually don't go
   through the "Entry page" but arrive at a website on some page Google found
   most relevant)

- the structure is consistent and doesn't lead to surprises

- the structure is hierarchical with a limited number of branches (for my
   limited mind)

Sometimes it might be useful to make different areas visibly distinguishable
from eachother, almost as if they where two different sites. Just so that
it's easy for me to see/remember where I am.

I am not a big fan of a navigation bar at the top and all sub-navigation
somewhere else (or not visible at all). The bread crumb path helps a little,
but only to go back and not to go forward. I know that this is a field for
"religious" discussions, I just haven't seen an implementation on any larger
site that I find really helpful. It's like a book with table of contents
distributed all over the place (not many of these exist and usually there is
more than just one level of hierarchy visible in the "main table of
contents" at the beginning/end of the book. I don't know why this rather
useful concept is suddenly overthrown on electronic media (just because you
can also search, doesn't invalidate a proofen concept). Anyway ...


On the Qooxdoo website my main difficulty is to find the right kind of
documentation, mainly because there is so much of it. Right now I was trying
t find the snippets area. Finally I found it via the search function and
then realized that it is "hidden" on page

  » Home » Documentation » Manual x.x

rather far down on a long page below "Other". I think such a long page with
links to other pages makes it difficult to find relevant information (I at
least knew already that "Snippets" exists).

I am not quite sure how to solve this problem (other than the actually quite
useful search engine, but that only helps if you know what you are looking
for, which might not be the case for new comers).

> - a book-like manual (see the discussion on the ML)

That would most likely be useful, but is probably A LOT of work ... I am not
sure about the cost/benefit ratio. Especially because it would also need
a fair amount of "maintenance", as Qooxdoo is (fortunately) a pretty lively
beast ...

> - an integrated "API Viewer/Demo Browser" for contributions

Yes, that would be most helpful. As would be an as small as possible contrib
area (meaning "good" contributions should be promoted to the main line as
quickly as possible) and a contrib area structured (or filterable) by
"working with Qooxdoo version x".

> Other than that, I am really happy with the toolkit, support by the devs
> and the community.

Yes, yes, yes!

Cheers,
Fritz

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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

Thomas Herchenroeder

> site that I find really helpful. It's like a book with table of contents
> distributed all over the place (not many of these exist and usually
> there is
> more than just one level of hierarchy visible in the "main table of
> contents" at the beginning/end of the book. I don't know why this rather
> useful concept is suddenly overthrown on electronic media (just
> because you
> can also search, doesn't invalidate a proofen concept). Anyway ...

I'm not sure I'm getting what you mean here. Are you talking about books
whos table of contents is "distributed all over the place"? I'm not sure
I've seen such a book.

> On the Qooxdoo website my main difficulty is to find the right kind of
> documentation, mainly because there is so much of it. Right now I was
> trying
> t find the snippets area. Finally I found it via the search function and
> then realized that it is "hidden" on page
>
>     » Home » Documentation » Manual x.x
>
> rather far down on a long page below "Other". I think such a long page
> with
> links to other pages makes it difficult to find relevant information
> (I at
> least knew already that "Snippets" exists).

I'm thinking in just the opposite direction. I'd rather see the manual
index page evolve into a full table of contents, hierarchical and with
indentation, that links to every other page of the manual. Then you had
both a systematic organisation of all the material and you could use the
browser search facility to look for key words on this page. Together
with a word index (also book-like) I think this would be the best
approach to get oriented and to find things. And it shouldn't be too
hard to generate a PDF from that.

T.

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Re: Your favorite aspects of qooxdoo !?

fritz
On Thu, 10 Dec 2009, thron7 wrote:

>> site that I find really helpful. It's like a book with table of contents
>> distributed all over the place (not many of these exist and usually there
>> is more than just one level of hierarchy visible in the "main table of
>> contents" at the beginning/end of the book. I don't know why this rather
>> useful concept is suddenly overthrown on electronic media (just because
>> you can also search, doesn't invalidate a proofen concept). Anyway ...
>
> I'm not sure I'm getting what you mean here. Are you talking about books
> whos table of contents is "distributed all over the place"? I'm not sure
> I've seen such a book.
That's exactly what I am trying to say ... most books have a toc at the
beginning. Some have additional more detailed tocs in front of major
sections/chapters.

>> On the Qooxdoo website my main difficulty is to find the right kind of
>> documentation, mainly because there is so much of it. Right now I was
>> trying t find the snippets area. Finally I found it via the search
>> function and then realized that it is "hidden" on page
>>
>>     » Home » Documentation » Manual x.x
>>
>> rather far down on a long page below "Other". I think such a long page
>> with links to other pages makes it difficult to find relevant information
>> (I at least knew already that "Snippets" exists).
>
> I'm thinking in just the opposite direction. I'd rather see the manual
> index page evolve into a full table of contents, hierarchical and with
> indentation, that links to every other page of the manual.
That doesn't really sound "opposite" to what I am trying to say ...

> Then you had both a systematic organisation of all the material and you
> could use the browser search facility to look for key words on this page.

That would certainly be helpful/

> Together with a word index (also book-like) I think this would be the best
> approach to get oriented and to find things.

Also helpful.

> And it shouldn't be too hard to generate a PDF from that.

The potentially tricky part would be to get page numbers into the index
(links won't work once printed).

Cheers,
Fritz

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Re: Logging in qooxdoo

balage42-qooxdoo
In reply to this post by Daniel Wagner
Hi Daniel!

This is great! Now I understand and like it. I've  even made an appender
class and it is registered to the logger.

A sidenote about the documetation: while the API doc for the Logger.register
function refers to the required appender class to be static and to have at
least a process() method (suggesting the method has no parameter), the
real requirement is a function with one parameter (entry). But this could
be found out only by checking any of the concrete implementations (Console
or Native). If there would be none, one could hardly find out how to implement
the appender correctly.


The other information I seek is the definition of the entry. I was able to find
out that the entry has several fields ( time, level, items, win, clazz (;-)), etc.)
I've found the entry specification also missing.

What I couldn't find out is much simpler: I "throw" a log message by calling
for example the this.debug( "test" ), and I would like to put into my log window
the text "test". I see (or at least I guess that I see the message to arrive to
the appender, but wasn't able to find the message itself.

What is the magic word? ;-)

Thanks,
Balage





----- Original Message ----
From: Daniel Wagner <[hidden email]>
To: qooxdoo Development <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wed, December 9, 2009 5:48:08 PM
Subject: Re: [qooxdoo-devel] Logging in qooxdoo

Hi Balage,

logging in qooxdoo is split up into a central logging engine (the static
class qx.log.Logger) which receives and dispatches log messages, and one
or more log appenders which do the actual processing, such as storing
and/or displaying messages.

The debug/info/warn/error methods that each qooxdoo object inherits from
qx.core.Object call the corresponding methods of qx.log.Logger, which in
turn calls the process() method of all appenders that are registered
with it.

A typical qooxdoo application will register two appenders:
qx.log.appender.Native uses the browser's own logging capabilities
(Firebug etc.) while qx.log.appender.Console is useful for browsers
without such tools. It is opened by pressing F7. If those or the other
appenders found in the qx.log.appender namespace aren't enough for your
needs, you can always write your own appender. I suggest looking at the
source of qx.log.appender.Element for inspiration.

There's no need to use console.log directly in your application: The
native logger uses it if the browser supports it, preventing any
exceptions if it isn't.


Regards,
Daniel

[hidden email] schrieb:

> Hi everyone!
>
> I have a quite silly question: I tried to figure out, how the logging
> system works.
> I found the methods debug, info, warning and error of the Object, and
> the console.log function.
> The later seems to work only with Firefox and Firebug, but having a
> console.log call in the source makes the application to throw exception
> when opening from other browsers.
> OTOH, I wasn't able to find whrere it goes and how I could get the
> results produced by Object methods.
>
> I tried to find info, but starting to realize, that many of the
> documentation (called "Manual") of Qooxdoo is rather a very high level
> summary of the features than a manual.
>
> Thank you!
>
> Balage
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Return on Information:
> Google Enterprise Search pays you back
> Get the facts.
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/google-dev2dev
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> qooxdoo-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/qooxdoo-devel


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Re: Logging in qooxdoo

Daniel Wagner
Administrator
Hi Balage,

[hidden email] schrieb:

> Hi Daniel!
>
> This is great! Now I understand and like it. I've  even made an appender
> class and it is registered to the logger.
>
> A sidenote about the documetation: while the API doc for the Logger.register
> function refers to the required appender class to be static and to have at
> least a process() method (suggesting the method has no parameter), the
> real requirement is a function with one parameter (entry). But this could
> be found out only by checking any of the concrete implementations (Console
> or Native). If there would be none, one could hardly find out how to implement
> the appender correctly.

You're right, the documentation is pretty lacking in this regard. I
opened a bug report for this, add yourself to CC if you want to keep
track of it:
http://bugzilla.qooxdoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3212

We're currently very busy preparing the 1.0 release, so I can't promise
this will be addressed soon, sorry.

>
>
> The other information I seek is the definition of the entry. I was able to find
> out that the entry has several fields ( time, level, items, win, clazz (;-)), etc.)
> I've found the entry specification also missing.
>
> What I couldn't find out is much simpler: I "throw" a log message by calling
> for example the this.debug( "test" ), and I would like to put into my log window
> the text "test". I see (or at least I guess that I see the message to arrive to
> the appender, but wasn't able to find the message itself.
>
> What is the magic word? ;-)
>

entry.items is the magic word, actually. It's an array of maps with the
keys "type" and "text". "type" is the type of data you've logged
(string, array, object,...), while "text" contains a serialization of
the logged data. Take a look at qx.log.Logger.__serialize() if you want
to know more.
If you just want a text representation of the logged data, have your
appender call the static method qx.log.appender.Util.toText(), which
takes the "entry" map as its only parameter and returns a text
representation.

> Thanks,
> Balage
>

Regards,
Daniel

>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Daniel Wagner <[hidden email]>
> To: qooxdoo Development <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Wed, December 9, 2009 5:48:08 PM
> Subject: Re: [qooxdoo-devel] Logging in qooxdoo
>
> Hi Balage,
>
> logging in qooxdoo is split up into a central logging engine (the static
> class qx.log.Logger) which receives and dispatches log messages, and one
> or more log appenders which do the actual processing, such as storing
> and/or displaying messages.
>
> The debug/info/warn/error methods that each qooxdoo object inherits from
> qx.core.Object call the corresponding methods of qx.log.Logger, which in
> turn calls the process() method of all appenders that are registered
> with it.
>
> A typical qooxdoo application will register two appenders:
> qx.log.appender.Native uses the browser's own logging capabilities
> (Firebug etc.) while qx.log.appender.Console is useful for browsers
> without such tools. It is opened by pressing F7. If those or the other
> appenders found in the qx.log.appender namespace aren't enough for your
> needs, you can always write your own appender. I suggest looking at the
> source of qx.log.appender.Element for inspiration.
>
> There's no need to use console.log directly in your application: The
> native logger uses it if the browser supports it, preventing any
> exceptions if it isn't.
>
>
> Regards,
> Daniel
>
> [hidden email] schrieb:
>> Hi everyone!
>>
>> I have a quite silly question: I tried to figure out, how the logging
>> system works.
>> I found the methods debug, info, warning and error of the Object, and
>> the console.log function.
>> The later seems to work only with Firefox and Firebug, but having a
>> console.log call in the source makes the application to throw exception
>> when opening from other browsers.
>> OTOH, I wasn't able to find whrere it goes and how I could get the
>> results produced by Object methods.
>>
>> I tried to find info, but starting to realize, that many of the
>> documentation (called "Manual") of Qooxdoo is rather a very high level
>> summary of the features than a manual.
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>> Balage
>>
>>
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>
>
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Logging

John Spackman
Hi guys,

Are there any plans to introduce a multi-level logging facility to Qooxdoo,
along the lines of log4j etc?  I.E. I'd like to be able to define different
logging levels for different packages or classes and have the logging level
inherited by inner packages and classes.

Thanks
John




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Re: Logging

Thomas Herchenroeder
Hi John,

> Are there any plans to introduce a multi-level logging facility to Qooxdoo,
> along the lines of log4j etc?

Not that I'm aware of. If this interests you, you should open a bug for it.

T.

>   I.E. I'd like to be able to define different
> logging levels for different packages or classes and have the logging level
> inherited by inner packages and classes.
>
> Thanks
> John
>
>
>
>
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Re: Logging

John Spackman
Hi Thomas,

Thanks I'll do that; I'm not saying I'll do anything any time soon (I've
still got to upgrade from 0.8.2) but would you guys be open to receiving a
patch for this (providing it meets your coding standards etc)?

John

-----Original Message-----
From: thron7 [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 13 January 2010 09:36
To: qooxdoo Development
Subject: Re: [qooxdoo-devel] Logging

Hi John,

> Are there any plans to introduce a multi-level logging facility to
Qooxdoo,
> along the lines of log4j etc?

Not that I'm aware of. If this interests you, you should open a bug for it.

T.

>   I.E. I'd like to be able to define different
> logging levels for different packages or classes and have the logging
level
> inherited by inner packages and classes.
>
> Thanks
> John
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Logging

Thomas Herchenroeder
John,

Thanks I'll do that; I'm not saying I'll do anything any time soon (I've
still got to upgrade from 0.8.2) but would you guys be open to receiving a
patch for this (providing it meets your coding standards etc)?
  

sure, go ahead. A lot of the functionality of what you are talking about was already present in the 0.7.x line of qooxdoo, but has since been abandoned. But if you consider creating a patch for 1.0.x, you might want to look at the 0.7 code. There's probably a lot that can be re-used.

T.

John

-----Original Message-----
From: thron7 [[hidden email]] 
Sent: 13 January 2010 09:36
To: qooxdoo Development
Subject: Re: [qooxdoo-devel] Logging

Hi John,

  
Are there any plans to introduce a multi-level logging facility to
    
Qooxdoo,
  
along the lines of log4j etc?
    

Not that I'm aware of. If this interests you, you should open a bug for it.

T.

  
  I.E. I'd like to be able to define different
logging levels for different packages or classes and have the logging
    
level
  
inherited by inner packages and classes.

Thanks
John





    
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